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This week on Witness History in 2011, Japanese tidying expert Marie Kondo released her debut book and became an organizing icon around the world.
Her method focuses on only keeping items that spark joy and speak to your heart.
Now a best Selling author, award nominee and household name, she tells us how she's a little more relaxed about tidying since having children.
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What I love about rock climbing is that the rock is kind of like a blank canvas.
And so no matter who it is pulling onto this same blank surface of rock that doesn't change for thousands of years, they're bringing to that blank canvas the colors that make the experience what it is.
You go through quite a range of different feelings.
You end up wrestling with your mind.
Climbing gets seen probably from the outside in as this very physical experience, but I feel like the internal experience is the hardest to grasp and the thing that makes it as potent as you know of an experience as it is for people.
All experiences are on the table when when you're climbing.
Take note of those thoughts of climbing as an internal experience, a wrestling match with your mind.
Because that question about his relationship with climbing, it's a lot more complicated than it seems.
Climbing has given Gus so much, but it's also taken almost everything from him.
You're listening to Lives Less ordinary from the BBC World Service.
I'm Assia Fuchs.
We're gonna start Gus's story in 2017.
He and a friend had gone on a big climbing trip to the US they were in Joshua Tree national park in California.
If you want to picture the scene, think about one of those old westerns.