Autocrats often dare their followers to believe absurd claims, as a kind of loyalty test, because “humor and fear can be quite close together sometimes,” says Peter Pomerantsev, a Soviet-born British journalist and co-host of Autocracy in America, an Atlantic podcast series. In this episode of Radio Atlantic, we talk to Pomerantsev and Atlantic staff writer and co-host Anne Applebaum about how to detect the signs of autocracy, because, as they say, if you can’t spot them, you won’t be able to root them out. We also analyze the events of the upcoming election through their eyes and talk about how large swaths of a population come to believe lies, what that means, and how it might be undone. Get more from your favorite Atlantic voices when you subscribe. You’ll enjoy unlimited access to Pulitzer-winning journalism, from clear-eyed analysis and insight on breaking news to fascinating explorations of our world. Subscribe today at TheAtlantic.com/podsub. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
I'm Hanna Rosen.
This is Radio Atlantic.
There's something new unfolding in this election,
something we haven't seen in this country on such a grand scale.
Kamala Harris said it bluntly at her acceptance speech at the DNC when she talked
about how tyrants like Kim Jong Un side with Donald Trump.
They know he is easy to manipulate with flattery favors.
They know Trump won't hold autocrats accountable because he wants to be an autocrat himself.
An autocrat.
How do you know if a leader is vying to be an autocrat?
It's an abstract title,
hard to picture playing out in the US but as I picked up in a new Atlantic podcast,
autocracy in America, if you know what you're looking for, you can see it pretty clearly.
People who have seen it play out in other countries can tick
through the list of autocratic tactics at work right now in the United States.
That was really the organizing idea of the show, was to tell people that stuff is already happening.
Now.
This is staff writer Anne Applebaum.
She is a Pulitzer Prize winning historian and co host of Autocracy in America.
Her co host is Peter Pomerantsev,